Do you ever worry about things folding together too neatly? A friend once described a piece of writing I loved as “too clever” - that is, for him, everything fit together too perfectly. Like a clockwork. I disagreed, but ever since I try to leave some space for accidents and messes in my stories. The nature of this particular process will inevitably create messes, I think, but what about the rest of your work? Can it be too clever?
I'm actually open to stuff sprawling because when you push out a little that seems to be a really good way to create big threads that pull back into the work. A lot of this looks like intricate planning (and some of that's there), but I blow stuff up all the time for a better, bigger, more interesting idea. I am very much not a person in love with how clever I appear to be, or am -- and I'm easily my harshest critic.
One of the things I always do when I'm pitching something is leave a giant gap in the presentation where I ask everyone an open-ended question that I know is a friendly opportunity to take a swing at the story. They usually do, and if I have an answer super, if I don't even better because that's something I missed or need to address.
Hm. I like that. Seems like a strategy that could work in the business world too. Thanks for the thoughtful response. I don't know the whole story, but it seems like the X-Men stuff fits into this discussion? Blow up your clockwork for a bigger idea(that hopefully still tells time)?
Have you had a chance to see Dune yet at any festivals or advanced screenings? Could you talk about your science fiction influences? Both your X-men work and 3W3M see to take lots of inspiration from Herbert work (Khor/Melange, Akkaro/Arrakis, Uninhabitable planets, father son relationships).
I'm pretty excited to see the new Dune. I already had a pretty high opinion of Denis Villeneuve, but Blade Runner 2049 was one of the few times in a long while that I saw a movie in the theater and was able to turn off the problem-solving part of my brain and just be blown away by the aesthetics of it. Like, it's kind of a mess as a story, but the spirit of it was amazing (which is why I love Lynch's Dune so much -- that movie gets so much wrong about the Dune Mythology, but captures the soul of it perfectly). Anyway, we built in a bunch of stuff to make Khor not Spice (we'll see if it works -- probably not, it's like having a story about a ring and someone not saying hobbits), and the Krakoa, Okkara, Arakko thing is just the letters scrambled up (but I laughed at Arakko being one of them). Anyway, long way around -- yes, Herbert's probably in my top five SF guys (Banks, Simmons, Herbert, Gibson...uh, can't think of who else -- you know, it changes).
I’m really digging these process posts, both as a comic fan and a programmer. I’m not a storyteller, but the language of comics has influenced my sense of creativity and workflow.
I love the concept of “mining continuity,” especially after the 3 Rock posts. It’s a good reminder to let things sit a little undefined or vague, trusting that the details will work themselves out naturally through collaboration.
Yeah, and as you do more and more of it, it turns into something like a competent chef who's doing everything by taste and not overly obsessed over measurements. So much of it turns into 'feel' because of how versed you are in the basic mechanics. (Hope that makes sense)
It does. It’s a good metaphor (simile?). I was just thinking yesterday that I’ve made this particular soup recipe so often that now I am making it by instinct.
I did, but I talked to Sasha today and she wants us to do an updated 'much cooler' version. Haha. She's actually cranking on a bunch of stuff you guys are going to like.
We've been re-watching Mad Men, we just started season 7, and yeah. That show is disgustingly good at making things fold back on the theme. The first episode of Season 7, where (SPOILERS FOR A TEN YEAR OLD SHOW) Freddie Rumsen delivers Don's pitch, but you don't know that it's Don's until the very end, after watching Peggy and Joan struggle to get taken seriously the whole time, is just...GOLD.
You gotta love that moment when separate pieces of your work suddenly connect in a perfect and unexpected way, completing a circle you didn't even realize was needed... especially when it's some throwaway piece of info that you mentioned early on connecting to something important, like you're Pee Wee Herman falling off his bike, "I meant to do that."
Does mining continuity generally take your stories in wildly different directions then your original plan, or does the plot generally stay the same for the most part?
I love this behind the scenes view at the process that you have. It makes me feel less awkward and weird about the ideas and idiosyncrasies I display when I write. If nothing else was available, this view at someone else's worldbuilding process is worth the price of admission for me.
Since you mentioned coincidence, what is the chance that the rock elements [Va][L][La][R] spell pretty much the same as the sorcento final shout ‘Vahl-lahr'? By now I wouldn't be surprised if you have imagined a whole periodic table in which every element has both physical and magical properties, so I guess the real question here is if this is something planned or just one of those gaps that you mentioned that can be filled as you go?
Do you ever worry about things folding together too neatly? A friend once described a piece of writing I loved as “too clever” - that is, for him, everything fit together too perfectly. Like a clockwork. I disagreed, but ever since I try to leave some space for accidents and messes in my stories. The nature of this particular process will inevitably create messes, I think, but what about the rest of your work? Can it be too clever?
I'm actually open to stuff sprawling because when you push out a little that seems to be a really good way to create big threads that pull back into the work. A lot of this looks like intricate planning (and some of that's there), but I blow stuff up all the time for a better, bigger, more interesting idea. I am very much not a person in love with how clever I appear to be, or am -- and I'm easily my harshest critic.
One of the things I always do when I'm pitching something is leave a giant gap in the presentation where I ask everyone an open-ended question that I know is a friendly opportunity to take a swing at the story. They usually do, and if I have an answer super, if I don't even better because that's something I missed or need to address.
Hm. I like that. Seems like a strategy that could work in the business world too. Thanks for the thoughtful response. I don't know the whole story, but it seems like the X-Men stuff fits into this discussion? Blow up your clockwork for a bigger idea(that hopefully still tells time)?
I haven't had a chance to relisten to them just yet, but I'm pretty sure the brick by brick Vince Gilligan thing is from one of these two podcast interviews. https://archive.nerdist.com/nerdist-writers-panel-30-vince-gilligan/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R0fKP2-BTEA
Cool. I'll listen later. Thanks!
I was thinking the same thing!
That’s what I didn’t know I needed, and now I’m hooked. Not just fun stuff. LAYERS of fun stuff. Comics and meta commentary, all bundled up!
Love this. Seriously. Love getting this look into the world building and how your ideas evolve as you go.
Have you had a chance to see Dune yet at any festivals or advanced screenings? Could you talk about your science fiction influences? Both your X-men work and 3W3M see to take lots of inspiration from Herbert work (Khor/Melange, Akkaro/Arrakis, Uninhabitable planets, father son relationships).
I'm pretty excited to see the new Dune. I already had a pretty high opinion of Denis Villeneuve, but Blade Runner 2049 was one of the few times in a long while that I saw a movie in the theater and was able to turn off the problem-solving part of my brain and just be blown away by the aesthetics of it. Like, it's kind of a mess as a story, but the spirit of it was amazing (which is why I love Lynch's Dune so much -- that movie gets so much wrong about the Dune Mythology, but captures the soul of it perfectly). Anyway, we built in a bunch of stuff to make Khor not Spice (we'll see if it works -- probably not, it's like having a story about a ring and someone not saying hobbits), and the Krakoa, Okkara, Arakko thing is just the letters scrambled up (but I laughed at Arakko being one of them). Anyway, long way around -- yes, Herbert's probably in my top five SF guys (Banks, Simmons, Herbert, Gibson...uh, can't think of who else -- you know, it changes).
Thank you so much for taking the time! I love your work so much.
Question for Mike H in the Dune sci-fi vein would love to hear about Chris Foss influences
I’m really digging these process posts, both as a comic fan and a programmer. I’m not a storyteller, but the language of comics has influenced my sense of creativity and workflow.
I love the concept of “mining continuity,” especially after the 3 Rock posts. It’s a good reminder to let things sit a little undefined or vague, trusting that the details will work themselves out naturally through collaboration.
Yeah, and as you do more and more of it, it turns into something like a competent chef who's doing everything by taste and not overly obsessed over measurements. So much of it turns into 'feel' because of how versed you are in the basic mechanics. (Hope that makes sense)
It does. It’s a good metaphor (simile?). I was just thinking yesterday that I’ve made this particular soup recipe so often that now I am making it by instinct.
I was wondering if you do the diagrams drawings yourself, great!
I did, but I talked to Sasha today and she wants us to do an updated 'much cooler' version. Haha. She's actually cranking on a bunch of stuff you guys are going to like.
This is a shit load of fun!!
Fun! Works of Joy! A not particularly otherworldly rock from another world!🙏❤️👍
We've been re-watching Mad Men, we just started season 7, and yeah. That show is disgustingly good at making things fold back on the theme. The first episode of Season 7, where (SPOILERS FOR A TEN YEAR OLD SHOW) Freddie Rumsen delivers Don's pitch, but you don't know that it's Don's until the very end, after watching Peggy and Joan struggle to get taken seriously the whole time, is just...GOLD.
You gotta love that moment when separate pieces of your work suddenly connect in a perfect and unexpected way, completing a circle you didn't even realize was needed... especially when it's some throwaway piece of info that you mentioned early on connecting to something important, like you're Pee Wee Herman falling off his bike, "I meant to do that."
Cool & Thanks. I think I said what was on my mind in the last post, Part 3. This post is a good primer for thought. Be well.
Thank you for sharing this post! and some of the the building blocks that have built you up to the writer you are today!
Does anyone know when issue 2 of this comic will come out?
Does mining continuity generally take your stories in wildly different directions then your original plan, or does the plot generally stay the same for the most part?
I love this behind the scenes view at the process that you have. It makes me feel less awkward and weird about the ideas and idiosyncrasies I display when I write. If nothing else was available, this view at someone else's worldbuilding process is worth the price of admission for me.
Since you mentioned coincidence, what is the chance that the rock elements [Va][L][La][R] spell pretty much the same as the sorcento final shout ‘Vahl-lahr'? By now I wouldn't be surprised if you have imagined a whole periodic table in which every element has both physical and magical properties, so I guess the real question here is if this is something planned or just one of those gaps that you mentioned that can be filled as you go?